WEBVTT 00:00:00.203 --> 00:00:04.984 Our next guest is one of the three European leaders who visited Kyiv 00:00:05.393 --> 00:00:08.000 to meet with President Zelenskiy about two weeks ago 00:00:08.391 --> 00:00:13.015 to express their support for Ukraine. You can see him here in blue. 00:00:13.720 --> 00:00:17.649 Janez Janša is the Prime Minister of Slovenia and joins me now 00:00:17.743 --> 00:00:20.133 from the capital Ljubljana. 00:00:20.391 --> 00:00:23.813 How did you find President Zelenskiy when you saw him? 00:00:26.298 --> 00:00:30.586 Good morning. We found President Zelenskiy determined to fight. 00:00:32.073 --> 00:00:35.907 And after our visit 00:00:36.277 --> 00:00:39.243 I'm 100% convinced that Ukraine will win. 00:00:39.714 --> 00:00:43.688 Time is of the essence, because people are dying every day. 00:00:44.277 --> 00:00:48.594 We have to do everything we can to support and help them 00:00:48.715 --> 00:00:50.315 defend themselves. 00:00:53.571 --> 00:00:57.828 We need to find the solution, don't we? Everybody wants an end to this. 00:00:58.109 --> 00:00:59.709 What do you understand 00:00:59.977 --> 00:01:04.149 to be the details of Ukraine's proposals for Russia 00:01:04.561 --> 00:01:09.391 after yesterday's talks? And what do you make of that proposal? 00:01:11.946 --> 00:01:15.782 When we spoke with President Zelenskiy, 00:01:15.979 --> 00:01:19.438 Prime Minister Shmyhal and their colleagues, 00:01:19.908 --> 00:01:23.969 that Ukraine, after what happened, 00:01:24.323 --> 00:01:27.211 they are prepared to change the constitution, 00:01:27.322 --> 00:01:30.391 and propose to their nation 00:01:30.931 --> 00:01:38.860 a referendum, abandoning their wish to join NATO. 00:01:39.165 --> 00:01:44.358 But at the same time they want institutional guarantees 00:01:44.601 --> 00:01:46.201 for their security. 00:01:46.351 --> 00:01:51.538 They see these institutional guarantees for the security 00:01:52.100 --> 00:01:54.693 in the full membership of the EU 00:01:54.863 --> 00:01:58.607 and stronger guarantees from world powers than they got 00:01:59.113 --> 00:02:02.357 in the Budapest Memorandum in 1994. 00:02:04.335 --> 00:02:08.678 Can you just be a little clearer about that? 00:02:12.819 --> 00:02:17.076 I think that they sadly realized 00:02:17.780 --> 00:02:21.740 that they need NATO now. 00:02:22.388 --> 00:02:26.889 And they don't have it. Neither membership or Article 5 guarantees. 00:02:27.444 --> 00:02:30.928 So why stick with this goal? 00:02:32.149 --> 00:02:35.274 Currently it's not helping them. 00:02:35.653 --> 00:02:40.563 They made a pragmatic decision. 00:02:41.145 --> 00:02:44.906 Because after they win this war, 00:02:45.141 --> 00:02:48.570 NATO will want them to join. 00:02:49.250 --> 00:02:53.024 The situation will be quite different than it is. 00:02:53.367 --> 00:02:58.645 When they win this war, the Ukrainian army will be one of the strongest 00:02:58.828 --> 00:03:03.356 armies if not the strongest on the European continent apart from Russia. 00:03:04.005 --> 00:03:09.255 This last sentence is also questionable. 00:03:09.831 --> 00:03:16.506 I think now the ball is in our court. 00:03:16.627 --> 00:03:21.980 We have to provide them with a track to full membership 00:03:22.697 --> 00:03:26.550 and NATO members or democratic countries across the world 00:03:26.947 --> 00:03:33.667 to support Ukraine with as much military help as possible. 00:03:34.175 --> 00:03:38.917 This is the only thing that will stop the war. -Let's talk about that. 00:03:39.215 --> 00:03:43.784 The US is working with Slovakia to identify the requirements 00:03:43.965 --> 00:03:47.784 that will allow them to give S-300s to Ukraine. 00:03:48.550 --> 00:03:54.066 Many countries have been hesitant to send Soviet-era 00:03:54.738 --> 00:03:57.659 air defense systems to Ukraine. 00:03:59.734 --> 00:04:05.878 Is the hesitation due to the possibility that that would provoke 00:04:06.660 --> 00:04:12.540 Russia to extend this assault into Europe? 00:04:13.527 --> 00:04:18.098 And do you support any offers of S-300s? For example 00:04:18.256 --> 00:04:21.582 the Turks have said they are not sending their S-400s. 00:04:22.005 --> 00:04:25.793 They need their own defense. Do you support 00:04:26.239 --> 00:04:31.840 any offer of S-300 air defense missile systems to Ukraine? 00:04:33.552 --> 00:04:36.278 Yes I do support this. 00:04:36.595 --> 00:04:42.747 This is equipment that Ukraine needs the most, 00:04:42.868 --> 00:04:47.984 because they are against the defense for the mid 00:04:49.026 --> 00:04:52.412 and high altitudes and Russia 00:04:52.533 --> 00:04:56.507 is dominating those two parts of the sky. 00:04:56.628 --> 00:04:59.922 So I support this. But I don't support 00:05:00.197 --> 00:05:04.845 speaking a lot about what we're giving them. 00:05:04.947 --> 00:05:09.790 I'm supporting strongly to deliver and not speak about it. 00:05:09.911 --> 00:05:14.498 Some countries are helping and are not speaking about this help 00:05:14.619 --> 00:05:18.631 and there are some countries which are speaking and unfortunately 00:05:18.983 --> 00:05:21.990 are reluctant to do something. 00:05:23.930 --> 00:05:26.459 Do you want to be a bit more specific? 00:05:28.243 --> 00:05:29.843 Well, 00:05:30.421 --> 00:05:34.615 for the countries that are helping and don't want to speak about it, 00:05:34.736 --> 00:05:37.537 I don't want to be specific. 00:05:38.102 --> 00:05:41.552 For those countries that are reluctant to help, 00:05:41.821 --> 00:05:45.959 we don't know for sure, which countries these are, 00:05:46.080 --> 00:05:50.723 because they are delivering the help, but they are denying it publicly 00:05:51.101 --> 00:05:56.718 because of different reasons. -This is really interesting. 00:05:57.163 --> 00:06:00.749 I don't mean to butt in, 00:06:00.875 --> 00:06:04.973 but this is really interesting, because we're being told 00:06:05.142 --> 00:06:09.301 that there's a big sense of unity. There has been a real coming-together 00:06:09.617 --> 00:06:14.184 by Europe and the US, by NATO allies to ensure 00:06:14.616 --> 00:06:17.771 this kind of pincer-like reaction 00:06:18.125 --> 00:06:20.967 on Russia. Are you telling me that behind the scenes 00:06:21.375 --> 00:06:26.412 everything is not as unified in Europe as we might be led to believe? 00:06:28.561 --> 00:06:35.389 Our unity is much bigger than expected, especially 00:06:35.866 --> 00:06:38.318 bigger than it was expected from the Kremlin. 00:06:38.733 --> 00:06:42.826 It was also bigger than I expected, 00:06:43.897 --> 00:06:46.797 because I was aware of the details. 00:06:46.918 --> 00:06:53.543 Russian aggression really found us unprepared. 00:06:54.981 --> 00:06:59.145 But if we calculate everything we are doing, 00:06:59.266 --> 00:07:01.176 I don't think it is enough. 00:07:01.773 --> 00:07:05.378 I strongly support the demand 00:07:05.499 --> 00:07:09.589 that President Zelenskiy delivered during our last NATO Summit, 00:07:10.048 --> 00:07:14.747 when he asked for 1% 00:07:15.070 --> 00:07:17.129 of our military reserves 00:07:17.437 --> 00:07:21.317 to be able to defend themselves. We aren't together on that, 00:07:21.687 --> 00:07:25.270 we're not giving them 1% of our reserves. 00:07:25.733 --> 00:07:28.652 Some countries yes, some countries want more. -I understand. 00:07:29.187 --> 00:07:30.787 But not all. 00:07:32.654 --> 00:07:37.169 Your country is one of Europe's most dependent countries 00:07:37.529 --> 00:07:40.325 in terms of Russian oil and gas imports. 00:07:40.446 --> 00:07:43.869 But you've expressed support for Europe's push to phase out 00:07:43.961 --> 00:07:46.145 that dependance. 00:07:46.711 --> 00:07:51.591 What are you doing to achieve that? What will the short-term shock effects 00:07:51.976 --> 00:07:54.075 look like in Slovenia? 00:07:56.482 --> 00:08:03.280 Well, thank God, the spring is coming and the winter is over. 00:08:03.977 --> 00:08:09.639 We are doing everything we can to get rid of this dependency 00:08:09.725 --> 00:08:11.892 till the end of this year. 00:08:12.846 --> 00:08:17.870 We are speaking with neighboring countries, with other countries, 00:08:17.991 --> 00:08:22.119 about the alternative sources and supply routes. 00:08:22.746 --> 00:08:26.439 We will build another pipeline. 00:08:28.629 --> 00:08:32.705 Yesterday, I visited our neighbor Croatia. We discussed, 00:08:33.247 --> 00:08:39.619 with the increase of energy terminal in their country 00:08:39.768 --> 00:08:43.143 to be able to supply Slovenia 00:08:43.341 --> 00:08:45.666 and some other Central European countries. 00:08:46.487 --> 00:08:49.627 I think that 00:08:52.788 --> 00:08:55.980 finishing the dependency on the Russian energy sources 00:08:56.530 --> 00:09:02.626 will happen much sooner than the Kremlin is expecting. 00:09:03.194 --> 00:09:08.408 But currently we are facing a really sad story, 00:09:08.529 --> 00:09:13.143 because with the payments for the Russian gas, oil and coal 00:09:14.163 --> 00:09:19.263 we are practically financing the aggression and the war. 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:00.000 Are you prepared to pay for Russian energy in rubles 00:09:25.315 --> 00:09:28.215 while you are still dependent on it? 00:09:28.948 --> 00:09:34.127 No, nobody in Europe is prepared to pay in roubles, 00:09:34.319 --> 00:09:37.471 this is also against the contracts which were signed 00:09:37.662 --> 00:09:42.283 and I think that the message from our ministers was very clear. 00:09:42.401 --> 00:09:45.619 I saw the message from the G7 ministers. 00:09:46.166 --> 00:09:49.533 Nobody will pay in rubles, I believe. 00:09:49.664 --> 00:09:52.674 Actually, we don't know what they look like. 00:09:56.196 --> 00:09:59.041 Prime Minister, it's good to have you on. I know you are a busy man. 00:09:59.162 --> 00:10:00.975 I really appreciate it. Thank you.